Bonus Mailbag: The Hall and more

The O's are afraid that he might torment them in their division? Any team in any division can kick the **** out of the o's, with Bedard or without. And this Peter Angelos guy, sounds like Hank to me.

Anyone watching Andy MacPhail's moves? Or how about the latest from Hank on Santana, no more than 5 years!
Darn, I find it so hard to think negative.

Here's what I just said about Cashman:

"If ever an award is established for Most Valuable Executive, Brian Cashman will get every vote every year during his lifetime and maybe even beyond.

Are any GMs in the Hall of Fame, or will Brian be the first?"

Cashman, a HOFer? I seriously doubt that. At best he is a mediocre G.M. What trades or moves has he made that really improved this team, and made it a championship team? The successes this team has had since he took over as G.M. are more attritutable to previous administrations, not him.

That would be so sweet if the Yankees could get Bedard, I watched him pitch a few times and he was pretty awesome I have to say. So does anyone think that Bernie Williams should get into the HOF?

jeterstar,

Williams was a very good player for the Yanks , but he just doesn't have quite the numbers to get in.

I haven't really sat down and studied Bernie's numbers but I have to agree with you Matt, you are the man after all! I wonder if David Cone or Andy Pettitte could get in?

jeterstar,

I don't think Cone will get in either. He doesn't even have 200 career wins, and only has 2 20-win seasons in his career separated by 10 years. Pettitte's chances I think are borderline, depends on how his career ends. The best, and fastest ways to look up a plays stats is to just Google the player.

As far as getting Bedard, It's a great idea. I can't see a good reason for not trading w/the Yanks. He would only pitch about 6 times a year, If he were a position player it would be different, also if they get value in the trade it may benefit both teams. But hold onto Cabrera, unless we can get Upton to replace him.
"GO YANKEES"

I thought some of you might be interested in this site, It has the Yankee Rosters from 1900 to 2007.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/NYY/pos.shtml

I'm sorry to say it, but Pettite wasn't going to get in before he HGHed up. Now this controversy has assured me that he won't get within the walls of Cooperstown unless he buys a ticket. If McGwire's 600 jacks won't get him entry for allegedly using performance enhancers, then Pettite definately won't get in because he "admitted" (if you can call it that) using PED's. None of these juicing losers need to worry about getting a spot in the hall. They can kiss my ***.

I HATE to admit this but if I had a HOF vote I would still vote for Clemens. Is that bad....?

Pamela,
It depend who he's up against. It's brave to admit that, but you're right, the man was and is a star. If he is up against people who attained the same star position and are known to have done it fair and square then **** no, Clemens does not deserve the vote. If it’s Clemens vs, lets say, McGuire (who I think used a needle or two) those are two stars who might have cheated in the game.

Good points, Sports Girl, anyway I'm sure your ready like I am for this weekend! Time to see Peyton kick some Charger "bleep", did you know I got Matt to join us as Colt fans....

IF Bonds doesn't get in, I don't think Clemens will either. Don't forget it's only temporary jeterstar.

Minor details Matt, Your'e a Colt fan!

No need to insult me!! LOL!!!!

Some interesting reading on the subject:

On Bernie's candidacy...

http://www.nysun.com/article/31888

On David Cone's...

http://www.armchairgm.com/David_Cone,_Dwight_Gooden,_and_the_Hall_of_Fame

Hall of Fame Monitor

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/hof_monitor.shtml

Matt come on dude, just admit it, you want to be a FULL Colt fan, and a temporary Phin fan, I know you do, I can feel it, your'e just in denial, just kidding or am I? Jeez, I should be studying, I should take pills for my ADD..

Matt,

Cone is already in the Hall along with Larsen & Wells!

Chaz,

What's your take on Pete Rose, the original Duck?

Matt,

I agree on the PED users. But Rose and Shoeless Joe only bet or thought about throwing a series. Same feeling for Hornung and Karros.

Thanks for the awesome links, Bryan.

SportsGirl,

You're right on about the PED users too! Do you think MacPhail will fail. How long did it take Cashman and whats our farm like now? Is the Boss retired or sick (excuse the double meaning)the message to Torre was from him. And Brian couldn't do much but find a Juan Acevedo or Aaron Small! Wasn't that brilliant? Is everybody forming a more positive opinion of Hank, **** I am!

Welcome to the winning side then Matt. I am ready. Ready. Ready. I specifically cleared everything this weekend. I don’t know why I didn’t even make plans on Friday or Saturday (maybe I need to transform into playoff mode). But since I formed this totally random obsession with Rascall Flatts I have a concert the weekend after. And I would love for the Patriots to play the Colts then. I wouldn’t dare go to the game considering the past.

Pettite won’t get in regardless of the steroid thing in my opinion. Just to sort of switch the topic, I know that the A-Rod situation is over and done with, but last time the guy won an MVP award, I think it got to his head and we all know that season. This time with all the hate he’s getting, and after the MVP, and after the contract if he does slump, I think that will be the last straw for Yankee fans. I now loathe the man but I root for the player in the man, but I just have less and less belief in him.***** it- can the season come so all these doubts and questions could just vanish? Who wants to countdown the days for me…I’m just to lazy.

Did you see A-Rod New Year's Eve on NBC. He's trying to work on his image to all of NY!

I may just have to go to Opening Day. I'll lead a standing o for A-Rod, and Farnsworth too if he comes in!

I see Pettitte pitching that day, again in the snow? Just the thought of March 31 at the Stadium chills me, both excitement and temperature!

My take on Charlie Hustle? I think that betting on your own team to win, and using drugs is like comparing apples to oranges. If Pete gets a lifetime ban for betting, these drug addict losers should get a lifetime ban for CHEATING. I think Pete had served his time, and he and Shoeless Joe should be reinstated.

robert,

First of all, it was chaz who brought up the PED issue, not me. Cone won't get into the HOF as a pitcher, just doesn't have the numbers. The Yanks have a very good system, but holding on to the young talent was a no-brainer lets not give him too much credit for that. The system still has a way to go to before being considered really good since it lacks quality position players. A good mover here and there don't make him a good G.M. He has still been outclassed by Epstein.

I got this one. 35 days and counting until pitchers and catchers...

35 days too much, Bryan.

Thanks for those links above too. I don't think Bernie can get in, but I want him too. He's my all-time favorite Yankee.

Cone won't get in, but I think Pettite has a shot, however long it may be. It all depends on how much longer he pitches, and how those seasons go.

I would tend to say that Bernie is just a very good player, not a half of famer. The problem is that when you compare him to Jim Rice, they are basically the same, except Bernie was much better defensively.

As for Cashman, there are currently noone who was primarily a GM in the hall of fame. Before you induct him, there are a lot of others that need to go in. John Shuerholtz (80s Royals and 90s Braves) would be the top of my list. The key to me for anyone to get in the hall is to have extended excellence.

Matt,

The 3:17 post where you said Bonds and Clemens don't belong is the PED statement I praised you for.

You think Theo is better than Cashman? Let's see:

3 WS for Cashman, 2 for Theo

9 AL East Titles for Cashman, 1 for Theo

6 yrs 9 million to Mussina vs 6 yrs 100 million to Dice-K

7 yrs 120 miilion to Giambi vs 5 yrs 70 million to JD Drew

Hughes, Joba, Kennedy vs Buchholz and Lester

And unlike every other team in baseball, you can't use the payroll of the Yankees to explain why they have been better than the Red Sox.

You also have to consider that Epstein has a lot more freedom to make moves than Cashman (see: Johan Santana Trade)

Chaz, I agree that Pete Rose an all time favorite for his hustle should be in the hall if only for his playing abilities. He knew how to play the game.
I also think Big Mac, Barry and Clemens all deserve the hall, They were great before the claim that they took drugs. Other players also took drugs an they could not achieve what they did. Unless the drugs improved their eyesight and made their bats quicker. I find it not to be a big problem. But thanks to the holier than thou media, They are condemned. If they cheated then so did Bud Selig and all of baseball, they knew what was going on. Bud should go before congress and tell what he knew and when he first knew about the roids and do it under oath.

I can handle 35 days. Is that until Spring training?

I needed Chaz' take on Rose to compose this to him: I totally agree that cheaters using drugs to attain HOF worthy performance results must be banned.

I also agree with Chaz on Rose 'cause his record was achieved without enhancement. I would lean towards Shoeless Joe being reinstated only because there is no proof he was part of the group that tried to fix the WS. Players admitting to being in that group or proved to be in it deserved the banning.

I also see a distiction between steroids and HGH. I think HGH is not clearly a performance enhancing substance or Pettitte would not have used it. He said it was used to help heal an injury and nothing else. Someone must clarify that for us.

distinction

The difference between Clemens' and Bond's usage and McGuire's usage is Clemens and Bonds would have had HOF numbers without the assistance of steriods. Does that make them more favorable, less favorable or on equal footing I dont know. We'll all have to see in te voting, for me I favor Clemens out the three because he seems attimant to defend himself now and he's innocent until proven guilty in my book. Bonds has been proven guilty to me, he's too shady about it, he's been charged with purgery so he's second on my list and McGuire is last because he disappeared rather than defend himself.

And I think Rose has done his time, let him in please

cjpenny,

Like I said, those 3 WS victories are the product of previous administrations, not Cashman. The players on those teams wee already in the system before Cashman so Cashman can't claim credit for any of that. I've asked this question several times, and have yet to get an answer: What trades or acquisitions has Cashman made that have made this team better, and have led to WS championships?

The only thing that matters are end results, so no one really cares how many signings Epstein has made which have turned out to be mistakes. It's hard to argue the Yankees have been better than the Sox when the Sox have won the WS twice in the past five seasons, and the Yanks have failed to win any. The past seven seasons have been the true test for Cashman, and when fans can really see how good he is. So far he has shown he is mediocre as a G.M.

Since Cashman doesn't have as much freedom to make his own choices in terms of personnel decisions, then there is no way he should even be considered a HOFer or even compared to Epstein or any other G.M.

Specifically related to winning the world series, I can think of two things off the top of my head:

-trading for Roger Clemens before 2000

-trading for David Justice at the trading deadline in 2000

Lets look at Theo's recent moves. Here are some of the key players:

Manny Ramirez - Signed before he arrived

Beckett - Traded for while Theo was not GM

Lowell - Traded for while Theo was not GM

And you also have to consider the fact that the Yankees have made the postseason every year that Cashman was GM (which the Red Sox have not done) and the fact that they have won many more games than the Red Sox since Theo became GM.

Oh yeah, he also signed Orlando Hernandez

In the discussion regarding future Hall of Fame selections of various Yankees from the 1996 team, there has been a major oversight involving two very obvious choices who will definitely be voted in at some future date....

George Steinbrenner and Joe Torre.

Everyone is focusing on the players, but lets not forget the great contribution Torre has made to all the winning Yankee teams over the past 12 years!

And, George Steinbrenner is one of the best [if not "the" best] Sports and Baseball owners of all-time! ...Now that it looks like Hank and Hal have taken over full control of running the Yankees, I think George should be voted into the Hall of Fame as soon as possible - so he can enjoy this great honor [now] while he is still healthy enough to do so!

Jimmy27NYY

http://baseballtheyankeesandlife.mlblogs.com/

Again, just because Crashman has made a couple of decent moves here, and there doesn't make him a good or great G.M., especially if he doesn't have as much freedom as G.M. as some have said. That just means he shouldn't be getting all the props he has been getting for the good moves he has made or the criticism for all the bad moves he has made. The bad moves he has made far outnumber all the positive moves he has made. Can't have it both ways. All that matters are the end results, and the results have not been there for Crashman in recent years. Also , expectations are higher for the Yanks than any other team in the majors, especially with the type of money they spend on the talent they have. It's expected the Yanks make the post season every season, so it's not enough enough to say that this team makes it to the post season every season, everyone expects them to get to the WS, and win it. Lets also not give Crashman credit for making moves that are no-brainers like signing Clemens, or keeping the young talent in the farm system. Despite having a great post season record Hernandez was a very average pitcher overall during the regular season, with the exception of one year, so the Yanks made it to the post season for other reasons other than having Hernandez on the team. No matter how you look at it Epstein has still outperformed Crashman as the results show.

You are so right Matt. Having to go as far back as 7 years ago to pick a couple of moves is pretty thin not to mention pathetic. Cashman has been totally outclassed by Epstein, doesn't matter mistakes he has made in the past, only the end results, and they speak for themselves. Cashman is very average as G.M. period.

Cjpenny, I have to agree with you. Matt, you can't just say that keeping the young talent was a no-brainer. If half the yankee fans wanted to go on with the trade for Santana, than I guarantee you that some G.M's in the league would have went on with that trade. I'm not saying that we should have made the trade for Santana, but it's definitely not an easy decision. By not trading the prospects, there are at least half of yankee fans out there who are pissed with cashman making that decision. But if he went on and traded for Santana, the other half would have also disagreed with that decision. So, this is surly not an easy decision. This decision will either make him or break him. We'll just have to wait to find out. If Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, and Melky turn out to be ace players in the future, then I would consider him to be a great G.M. But if they turn out to be a bust, then there will be a lot of criticisms surrounding him. The fact that he kept Hughes, Melky, and Kennedy (players that have not yet proven themselves) from the best pitcher in the league is not an easy decision at all.

Amire and CjPenny,

It is an easy decision when you have spent the last 7 years trying the exact opposite strategy and failing EVERY SINGLE YEAR. Cashman is the most inept part of this team. And the arguement that Theo is not doing better than Cashman is awfully shortsighted. Look at the scoreboard. They have 2 World Series titles since 2000 and we have exactly ZERO. Theo wins. Brian Cashman is a dolt. The minute we can get a GM with a pulse, we will be right back on top in the MLB. While under Cashman's tenure, we will just have to hope that we catch lightning in a bottle. GO YANKEES!!!! Any World Series we get while under Brian Trashman will be in SPITE of him, not because of him.

amire,

You also have to factor in past history here. We've traded very good prospects for supposed well-established veterans who turn out to be nothing but disappointments. G.M.s would also look at that past history, and decide whether it was a successful method of building a team. Whether fans agree with a trade or not doesn't matter there will always be those for, and against a trade so G.M.s aren't necessarily going to base their decisions on fan reactions. Also, like people have been saying, if he doesn't have as much freedom as other G.M.s in terms of making personnel decisions, then you can't call him a great G.M. or a bad G.M. It goes both ways.